EP013: Jate Earhart & Creating Disciples While Playing Video Games

Well, I tell you what, listening audience, I'm excited about this episode. We've got Jake Earhart. I promise you, you've never heard of this kid before, but he's awesome. So he hit me up. He hit me up through the website for the first time, never heard of him. I just get this form to the website that says, "Hey, I run a discipleship ministry for video gamers," and I'd like to talk to you. And I'll tell you right there, I paused. Discipleship ministry for video gamers. Like, I don't know that I've ever seen those words together on the same page before. And it made me want to talk to him as soon as possible. And I did, and I got to tell you, I was really impressed. Talk about unconventional ministry, right? This kid is literally doing discipleship, teaching people to share their faith so that they can reach into the video game community using tools like Discord. And if you're like me, I barely knew what Discord was. And this person, Jake, is literally doing this. He's discipling others to share their faith through video games like Xbox and PlayStation. Like, how awesome is this? So you're gonna love this episode. Talk about a crazy idea. Look for a unique perspective in how to do biblical community, how to create a discipleship community. This is it. Here's Jake Earhart, myself, and of course, Raidy Armas from Christ Fellowship Miami on how to create a discipleship community for video gamers.

Here's Ray. When I'd heard what you've been doing, I was just blown away because I'd seen kind of a vision for this and seeing the community gather, just from the little bit that I had seen online. Yeah, yeah, I love the game, but I'm not like in the community like this. But I knew that there was such a strong pool that if other people could see what you're doing, you know, my prayer is that this inspires them for what could be, you know. So yeah, are just not gonna get it, but if at least they can get a vision for, man, there are people in my community, my passion for this, and I can empower them, right? Are doing the same thing that, to me, is the big win.

Yeah, yeah, I know I agree. It's it is just like, it's people, you know, like it, it's the thought of like, this is a group of people that have been almost pushed out of church at some point in time because like, I know I grew up with, I grew up with like Atari games because my parents weren't sure about gaming. It was like, I don't know, that might be from the devil. We haven't decided yet. Like, and so they had an Atari, but it was like, we don't think we want him to play games because I don't know. My dad was a church planter, my mom was a worship leader, and so they both were like, yeah, this is, we're not sure. And since we don't know, we're just gonna err on the caution side, kind of the same way people did with movies and stuff. And so I thought that's where the rule of like, you have to beat the game started was Atari because Atari was way before my time, way before my time, but it was before my time.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, right, right. But that's what I grew up with. It was a story, you know. I played Atari because my parents weren't gonna buy anything new, and so I had a whole suitcase of Atari games. So I probably beat more Atari games than like most people have beaten Atari games. And I played through like E.T. That game sucks. That's, I've beat it. It's one of the worst games of all time. The game is an awful game. And like the gold, like you go down the pit and then you go like stretch your neck out and you like go back up and it's orangey. Like half of the game, it's so bad. But like that game, like I figured, I don't even know how I figured out how to beat that gate. Like I know the, you know, this, like the glitch in Adventure and stuff like that. And Joust, we played Joust all the time. That's kind of where I convinced my dad that it was good because we would play together in two-player mode, and it was like, you know, okay, we're, I see community here and stuff. And as we went, then people would kind of gift us systems. So I'm like twenty-seven, but the games I played in gaming terms was like Atari, and then I played Sega, and then I played Nintendo and got, you know, Zelda, and I got a Game Boy when it came out. And it was like, I've gone through the whole process from the actual start to the end where we're at now in the order, probably better than most people have, at least for sure my age, because people just were like, yeah, I had a sixty-four from the time I was young, you know? It's like, okay, well, you know, I didn't, I think deal with that. I had, you know, Spider-Man and Castlevania, you know, or whatever.

So what kind of community are you seeing come out of this? Because it's kind of crazy to imagine that people, and not only are they jumping into it, but really making it something where they're talking about it and it's introducing like this whole new space where they can move and interact and be and be themselves, which was great.

Yeah, yeah, community-wise, we're seeing a ridiculous amount of community at where we are seeing it anyway, because it's like a natural thing. I think when people do something they love, especially something that is already geared towards multiplayer, something that's already geared towards like interaction, you're gonna want to interact with other people. I think it's kind of natural. Like, we see groups of people that they want to talk about movies, and that makes sense because like a lot of stuff happens in movies. But when the actual thing is interactive by nature and multiplayer, I mean, it's like of course you're gonna see community. Like, she totally should. It just makes natural sense. But the community that we're building is it's like it's a very positive environment, but it's also a very open chat. And I think like our original goal was it should just be really, really positive. And it's moved more into like what people need, at least the people that are in our group. Because like I was saying, there's no one with like, you can go with one thing in mind and just, you know, this is what's needed. And what people really needed was just open, like people being willing to hear what they're saying and accept it as like a human emotion or the way that they feel. And it's like, yeah, I acknowledge that what you just said has worth, and thank you for like letting me hear that, you know? And that's such a small thing. But yeah, like it's funny because when we're talking about like when I'm think about positivity, if you've, what did you watch the Mister Rogers movie? I love Mister Rogers so much, man.

Yeah, I had an impact on my life. I call him Fred, as if like we were boys, but yeah, that's that's how I feel about it, you know? It's like he's like super positive, but what do you, just being positive isn't really what he did. Instead, it was like he would talk to kids like they were more than just, you know, just a thing that was there or whatever. It's like, I care about you. Like, what you're saying is important, and I want to understand you. And that's like something that I don't know if it's lost in our community because there's a chance that, you know, perception or whatever, but I feel like we really have lost the art of hearing people, you know? It's like listening is one thing, but then like actually hearing and taking in and saying like, what you have has value is lost. And I especially in the gaming community where you hear so much input, you know? It's like ads almost. It's just people talking. You join a lobby for like five seconds and meet somebody, and then you land and die, and you're like, I see you, you know? And you never have to talk to them again. And it just becomes burned in your mind that these are just noises in your game, and you're not, you know, they're not actual people.

Oh, I think that's kind of what we're trying to break past is like, no, like you were a person. Let's actually have community and not just thirty seconds in a game. And yeah, it's been really good.

How are you helping bridge that gap in terms of community and all that stuff?

Hmm, yeah, it's hard, honestly. The hardest part is how do you like reach people that need that? Because once you can connect with them, that hits like cool. Like, now we can talk and we can do that thing, you know? So our community is, well, at like at the time of this, it's like six hundred seventy people or something like that. And it is, yeah, it's no, it's gotten really big. But the actual like community is probably closer to like fifty, you know? Because a lot of people join in, though, and they'll talk maybe every once in a while, just kind of look in, and that's fine. But then there's like people that everyday there, this is where it's like their new Facebook, you know? I don't like saying that because I, it's like you don't want to replace anything. But for a lot of people, Facebook has gotten kind of the epitome of what I was talking about where it's this echo chamber of, you know, algorithms will help you find the things that give you the type of things you care about. And so it's just like you never get another opinion. It's just here's the things you care about because the people you followed. And so if you do see a bad opinion, you're gonna post your little rant or whatever, and then if you don't want to reply after that, you don't have to because you can just say what you want to say and you leave. And with a chatroom, it's very much more. You see what's the last thing said, and at any point in time, somebody else could join and have just as much say as the next person, especially in the way that we have it set up.

I deleted theirs. We had colors for like mods. We had to call our admins had a color, like different colors to dictate hierarchy in our structure. And like at least for the time being and for the last three years, I that's all been removed. So it's every person has the same, that I do have is a level system. So the more that you talk, the bluer your name turns. It kind of starts like more of a dark blue, and then it turns more like a lighter blue, the longer that you're in the chat that you've been talking. So that way you can kind of get a gauge of like, oh, like this person has influence because they talk more. And that's just to encourage other people to actually engage. And that way it's less of a this person has power because you know they have the word admin or this person because they have the word mod. It's more like the real world. What, okay, if you want more influence, like just just talk to people more. And so that's that's kind of the thinking there.

But yeah, I mean, that's really the base of our community is very simple. At least at the start, we were fifty-fifty Christian on Christian. I would say that's pretty fair. And at least that was our understanding. And we talked to people, and we're very open. We had a channel for prayer, had a channel for encouragement where we would release the videos that were just, we saw like a stair-step system. I don't want to jump too much, but like we saw like a stair-step system where people are going to need different steps. We talked about like next steps in church a lot. And so it's like, what does it look like for people to take the very first step? And that might be to just talk to somebody who is a Christian, like not even anything beyond that. And if you talk to someone who is a Christian, then your next step might be to have that person mention something that's spiritual so you understand where that person is spiritually. Those are, there's something called the five levels of communication. And you know, we would talk about those. And it's like, you know, first there'd be a just a base level communication, and then maybe...

You'd have something that was personal, like something, what is your avatar mean? And then it's like meaningful, you know, usually is something bad that's happened in your life, for like what you're dealing with. And that's kind of the prayer would take that. We could, we can, what can be praying for you?

And then if you, I mean, if you're in a prayer channel, then we'd ask you probably about your spirituality. And that's that's not even the last one. That's just where you ask spiritually. And some people, a lot of people feel like they relate to spirituality, but they may not relate to even a God. They'll just say, hey, I feel very spiritual, you know? It's like, okay, well, can you dig into that a little bit? I feel like that's a term today we've taken, and then the fifth one is gospel. Yeah, so we'd say, like, you know, this is where you'd share your faith or or so and so. But we would, we thought, you know, we think about those and like stairsteps, and it's like, how do we get people to the next step as they're going? And the encouragement channel was sort of that tipping point where it was a video that was based on a game, and whatever the game was, and then they would, we'd have like videos or a section at the end that would kind of relate it to something in the Bible or not even always to something in the Bible. Sometimes it was just, here is something that, like, this is why it's helpful to be positive. Here's a way of thinking about mental health or whatever. And sometimes it led itself to a Bible verse, and sometimes it's led itself to just, here's like the truth of it, you know?

Yeah, there's kind of some of the things we've tried. So what you basically have there is a discipleship process. Like, I did, did you come up on that with your own? Did somebody go, like, what would it, that look? No, yeah, I mean, for me personally, New Life, the church that I attend full-time and is, I've been working there full-time for four years now. And they're like, they're really good. They're there. Their process, at least in the time, so whenever I first joined, by the time I joined, they were already doing Exponential. They like Church Planner Conference. The executive pastor there before I was there, the executive pastor left, just start Exponential, and then Todd Wilson, and then they continued that understanding that the best way to reach lost people is to start new churches. And so they have, I mean, it's something like thirteen percent of all of our tithes and offerings goes to starting new churches. And so we've continued to like do that, but we've also pushed more into a, well, the same way Exponential has it. It's the multiplication idea. And to multiply, you have to make disciples that make disciples that start churches that plant churches. And so through their staff meetings over the last couple years, especially as we move more into discipleship, like they've taught a lot of strategies, but they've influenced, low size, emphasize that it's been not about the strategy, you know, but the heart of it. And yeah, and so it's like, how can I, how can I take, I've always seen it through this view, and I already know my ministry before we started in this. So it was really like, as I'm hearing it and I'm writing stuff down, like, okay, how can I immediately apply this to what I'm already needing it, you know? So that's that's been really, really helpful.

Yeah, now let's let's just unpack this a little bit, like, because you've got your ministry, right? And so like, this video game ministry, is this, yeah, is this through the New Life? This is attached. Like, we're walking through the Genesis. You kind of fast forwarded, which is awesome. One hundred seventy people. Like, walk us through, like, day one. Where'd this thing start with?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, so started, so me, me personally, I can remember where I was. Where I was driving, actually. I've been praying for six months with my small group that I wanted something that had more purpose. It felt like it connected more the dots because, you know, I, I feel like I was just kind of going through the motions. I wasn't working at a church at the time, wasn't doing anything like that. And as I was, I was praying about this stuff, I remember where I was where I felt like I just said, you know what, about a game church? And the, I almost crashed because I was just like, that's such a crazy idea, but it like makes sense. Like immediately, it was like, this just all of that makes so much sense for so many reasons. And so I Googled Game Church, and there was one organization literally called Game Church, and I joined it. And I emailed them, and I think they're gonna like, okay, you know, whatever. And it was a Facebook group. They went to, and they still do. They went to events like PAX. I ended up going to PAX West, and they would set up a table, hand lanyards, and tell people Jesus loves you. I mean, it was very, very basic. It was just like, here's that, the very, we don't want to go too far into any of this. And and that was really good. And I was a part of that Facebook group. That's a, that's a big group. That's bigger than this is a big, big group. And they, they did that for years. And eventually, I started to notice that I could only get so far with people, like communication-wise. We weren't really seeing any, you know, not that baptism is like the epitome of everything, you know. Sometimes you plant seeds, and the idea was to plant seeds in this group. But I really wanted, I didn't know, I couldn't see a logical connection of like, where people would go on that, you know? And so it was like, I'm seeing a need. And so I was an admin of this, of this group. Like, I was really into it. And so I wanted to go a little deeper. And so I built, we started this Discord, and with other people in Game Church, and it was, it was a Game Church type thing. And the thought was, in the Facebook group, we had a policy to not talk about overly religious things. This is a religious group, and the idea was that we don't want to push people away that are joining from the that community because they see it for the very first time. It's just like, this crazy over a spiritualist name. But the problem is that, that also kept us from being able to go deep with people and the things if they wanted it. And we couldn't tell if they wanted it or not. And then we just seemed like we weren't any different than just a normal gaming group, you know? And so what, where's the difference? I just, this started to happen, notice all this stuff. And so we said, if that group is the lobby, the lobby of a church or whatever, that we needed place that actually, that would be the like outside area. We needed a lobby. We needed a place that people can actually come to and talk with each other. And just posting a Facebook message and then somebody else posting underneath, like, I'll never get a deep conversation that way. I might get one string of thought, but like, I need, I need more than that if I'm gonna have a conversation with somebody. Like, this conversation we're having, imagine how long that Facebook thread is, and we're doing it in an hour. It would take all day, you know? It's just, it's not fast enough. So we started a Discord. People started to talk. It was really good for a long time. It was like me every other message to just keep the conversation going. I felt like a like a human AI for a while. It's like, you know, a submit a word and I'll submit one back, you know, or something back. And it was, it was very, it's kind of slow, but as it started to build and build, we got more and more people. I could kind of leave for a little bit, and other people would, you know, respond. And it's just slow, but as it builds up, so that, that's that's the where it started.

We did, we had a point in time though where there was a huge falling out with admins, leadership, honestly, it was specific leadership in Game Church. And has happens. And so we just decided, along with a couple other people, we're gonna break off, and we're gonna do a separate thing. We became Love Clan, which is something that the, the like, name kind of started from a, we had a sport or not a sports, yeah, like a Call of Duty clan called Love Clan back when I worked at another church. And so it was just like, I would go that direction, and another group became Lovely Nerd. And they're really cool, doing kind of the same.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, they, they're great. They're super great. You should look them up. To Love That Nerd. And they do sort of a more blog style where they'll come up with articles that are specifically geared towards gamers in the nerd culture, and then they look kind of a Christian spin on it.

So wait, I've seen that. Wait, we seriously like that Love Thy Nerd, the blog?

Yeah, that's good. Yeah, yeah, so there, there's that's kind of in the same, yes, we're all, yeah, we're, yeah, we were all at one point time. We were all together. So we were all in Game Church. We split. Actually, the guy that really ran the Game Church side of things is now running the Love Die Nerd thing. So there's a lot of similarities probably between what Game Church and Love The Nerd are, and then ours was. Because we already had a community that was like even separate from the Facebook thing because we were doing gaming events and stuff like that, it's kind of like they focused you further in. We were, we're very outreach group. Game Church was very outreach, obviously. We would go to conventions and hand stuff out and all that. And I, and I wanted more of the like personal, intimate connection stuff, more discipleship, like you're saying. And so I, we did the Discord, and they became even better, I think, at what they were doing as far as the outreach. And Game Church took on different management. And so Game Church is continuing doing what they're doing. It for me, it feels like, you know, like a four, just like God forced us to multiply. Like, this thing happens, you know what seemed like it was bad is actually gonna turn out for good. And now there's three groups, and we only had one, you know? So it is, it's a great thing in the long run. At the time, obviously, it hurt. But but now we have a group that's really good at outreach, and like, we're getting pretty good at discipleship. And yeah, it's, it's good.

This is amazing. Jeff Koz, could we actually be talking about our very first online church split? You don't, I'm saying, like, times in the past, like, hey, has a youth ministry, youth ministry wants to take it to a certain area. Those folks grow up, and all of a sudden, you know, the leadership that's in play is like, not, we're not going that direction. We're going this direction. Next thing you know, you got two churches, and both of them, you know, well-meaning, reaching their community, doing great gospel work. But there was just a disagreement. There was a Paul and Barnabas moment where it was split. We don't get along, but God used that at the end of the day. This is fascinating. It's great. Like, in Jake, you've mentioned this, and the first time I met you, liked it, right? I've really spiritually, I met you. I think you hit me a website, and we started talking. Yeah, virtually counts. But we, you were talking to think that I was like, man, this is, this, I gotta, I gotta talk to this guy because you usually gave video game ministry and in discipleship like in the same sentence. And I'm like, okay, anybody's using video games like Xbox, PS4, like, I gotta understand this. In discipleship means so many things. Like, like a label itself. And so like, let's let's put some tangible enough stuff. This, hmm, what discipleship look like in context of video gaming of the people that you're reaching? Like, what is the goal? If you have a process, what's the goal of your process to help you?

Sure, yeah, yeah, no, you're right. That is that is a thing. Like, I mean, we could talk forever on what does disciple actually mean because there's full books that are like, yeah, I got it down, and then like, you go to the next store town, and they're just like, totally different thing, you know?

I've heard the original word for disciple would be like a learner, like somebody who learns. I've heard apprentice, you know, is the word disciple. It's one that we've taken more of a Christian term now. I usually tend to lean towards seeing disciple as somebody who hears and follows God. That's the definition that we use at New Life. So it's in there somewhere. It's someone who hears and follows God and wants to continue learning about God and teach others to learn about God. So it's something like that, you know. And so I think that's, with that in mind, that's where I go to is like, how do I have processes that help me help people hear and follow God in a new way, but also help people learn about God, maybe if they've been shut down to it? How do I, as that work?

So there are lots of different ways to do that. If you, I know we talked last time a little bit about Three Circles. Yeah, that's it. It's Bill Smith and Jeff McDaniels. Those are two names. Definitely look up T40. It's a book that we put out at, well, yeah, so look those up. There's a really good T40. But those ideas, it's like, how do we take the strategies that churches are using to train disciples? How do we take those things and bring them into an online space? And it usually happens organically. And I say it happens organically because God works organically. God will do things in ways that are like completely not natural, and it becomes natural over time.

So like, by praying for God to go ahead of us, He does, you know. And a lot of times it's like, okay, I have tools. God, I'm prepared. Just let me speak boldly. If you put something in front of me, I'll be ready for it. And then it happens. And like, I can't emphasize enough the importance of prayer in this thing. Because I would pray, so just, I'll do an example. I did a Destiny raid. Like, really long. Destiny has these raids that are like, oh man, sometimes three hours. If you're doing it first time, it can go even longer. That first time I did the Vault of Glass took me like seven hours, I think, because it was like the first time you're doing it and you have to do it with a group. So you take like six people and you all go and try and do this thing and you just all shut your schedules down for like the rest of the day. And so we did this thing and while you're doing it, you're not really talking because you're having to communicate. It's very in-depth, very mechanically specific of what you have to do. It's a puzzle. It's like a three-hour puzzle. And I, you know, I completed it with this group of guys, these random people I found online. And at the end, this guy was just kept talking. And like, everyone else is like, "Hey, thanks for the run. Really good. Nice to meet you guys," and then I leave in the chat. And this guy just kept talking. Like, "Yeah, hey, thanks guys. Yeah, you know, I got work in the morning, but I, you know, yeah, I work at this place down the street. You know, it's just how it goes." And it was just like, you like, just won't really, one that I guess communication or something. And so I stuck around in the chat and I'm like looking for a way to leave, but it's not happening. And before I know it, it's just him and I together in the chat. And so I was like, I got, I don't, I don't know, this is kind of like a weird place to, whatever, but let's, I do, you know what? Let's just go for it. And so I asked him, you know, well, what do you do? And he said, "I am, well, I'm in the Air Force or something like that." And I was like, "Oh, cool. You know, I, what do you do? I work at a church." And that's usually an in for me because I can just, I work, you know, what kind of church were you to, you know, so on and so forth. And that conversation, he basically said, "Oh, yeah, well, there's there's actually a bunch of churches in our place where we're at in the, I don't, I think he was, it's like flight, flight stuff. I don't know if he actually flew or whatever, but he was saying, yeah, there's there's lots of different churches and I've been trying all of them, but I was just wasn't sure what to, you know, how to, what to make of them and like which one to go to." And so we were able to like literally go into, here's like the Bible and Three Circles and then so and so forth. And we did this over chat. And then he left. And I've seen him a couple times in chat here and there, but it was just like that, that felt like planting a seed, you know? Like, that's that's a seed more than just "Jesus loves you," and like, yeah, everybody had already heard that or whatever before. But the same thing, I was like, that was pretty crazy. And then the next time I did a raid, the exact same thing happened. And I was like, "I, God, I mean, this is just wild. Like, the exact same thing." And so I was just like, whatever, God, okay, what do you do, right? That's them. The same thing. They said, "Oh, well, I'm a carpenter." I was like, "Oh, my gosh, like, is a softball one?" Like, "Yeah, so happens." I mean, it really, you know, it's like that was easy. Yeah. But that, that's the, so the online, the in-game stuff, we're figuring that out. It doesn't always happen, but it's it's an openness. Like, once you, it's the same thing. I don't tell people when they're learning discipleship that it's like, okay, the end goal of this is that you go to the mall and you find somebody and then you convert them or whatever. Like, that may happen and that's really good when it does, but I want you to like pray about this and have God show people in your life that, like, boycotts, you know, like, who are the people in your sphere of influence currently that you can be talking to? And the thing for the online game industry is it's like you're already talking to these people. I just want you to be hearing what God's saying if He's saying anything. And if it shows up, then like go for that, you know? And that's what we're trying to get people to understand.

So I don't know if there's a strategy for that one as much, but there's definitely a strategy for how to reach people to get to that stage, like Christians that maybe haven't seen their games as something that could use this ministry. And for me, it's taking the verses seriously that say, "In everything that I do, glorify God." You know, like, that includes my gaming. Like, that includes my personal time and my entertainment time. And it's not, yeah, on Sundays from for one hour, like, that's where I glorify God. It's, you know, it's it's everything. It's my whole life.

So yeah, that's a powerful man. How then are you encouraging other people to kind of take on the same thing? Because I imagine, you know, there's a lot of people in your sphere like you're saying that have a passion both for gaming and they see the potential for its ability to reach people for Christ or even to disciple folks. So how does that transition to the next person, not just from you, the leader?

Yeah, so we have a core group and Love Clan, and those are kind of the people that they've identified themselves as people who are just active in that community, but they're also like spiritual leaders through people that are almost plants in our group that, like, if they see an opportunity, they're gonna hop on it. We talked about like Wolfpack, of just when somebody new joins, you Wolfpack them, you know? Like, you're just like, "Yeah, how's it going?" You just the feel of like flooding with love. This so often that people will join and just leave immediately. It's like, "Now what? I was looking for it," you know? But if like eight people or like, "Hey, how's it going? Hey, how's it going?" It's like, okay, well, I mean, like, I feel really connected already and I just joined. So like, that kind of getting that stuff, the basics, that's a good, that's a starting place, having people feel like you, there's a community. But with our core group, we've talked about these things being intentional and all the stuff like, you know, I've been talking about. Those are things we'll talk about in our core group. And for the very first time, this has been really good. Tuesday, actually, which is why I'm kind of glad we delayed this, Tuesday was our very first Bible study. So we did a Bible study on actually some of the stuff Jeff that you had shared in a post about somebody else that did a similar thing.

Yeah, so we were like, we're reading through that. I shared that with our group and they were like, "Yeah, this this is encouraging. Like, we needed to do this stuff." And so it was really like, this is actually where it's where it's kind of nice. The limitations helped us in this way. This court currently has a limitation of 10 people to a voice channel. So it's kind of like Zoom. In it's the same, we could do a voice channel or we could do a video channel and we can talk and all this, but with Discord, the max is 10 people and you can talk as long as you want and you don't have to pay for it. So you know, Zoom has like a forty minutes, you have a limit or something, and you have to pay for it, and you have to do, sir, there's certain limitations. As long as it's 10 people, you're totally unlimited with Discord, at least currently.

So are, yeah, and so that, there you go. 10 people is the max for our small group, and we will do a video chat. And so are the push there for discipleship for multiplication literally comes from a currently technological, you know, people, they don't realize that it's more than that. I want one a small group to be more than 10 people anyway, but I can blame it on like, "Hey, guys, like, I, you know, sorry, we literally can't have more than 10 people. There's other people out here who want to have this what we're having right now, a discussion. And so like, I need you guys to lead this group." So either I can go and I start another group that's at another time, or you know, guys lead this group. Test it. We'll do the, like, so last week was the first one, and at the end of it, I told them, "Hey, I'm gonna do this like one more time, but I need you guys to like be watching because I literally, we filled that group that, like, there was seven this week, but there was already ten planned and the other slots were people that said like, 'Hey, I can't this week because I finals, but I need to like, I'll be there next week,' or you know, stuff like that." And so we have ten, like, we're at ten, and I didn't met, I messaged like 12 people maybe. Like, it was like immediately people are like, "Oh, we're into that. Like, yeah, we want to be part of that. That's something that we're interested in." So I mean, we got 10 immediately, and I have a whole list of names of people that I probably could message and fill another group right now. So I just need like another another leader. And so the this group, I said, "I'm gonna let you guys watch. Watch what I'm doing. It's gonna be you watch or I do. You watch and then I do. You help and then you do. I help and then you do. I watch." And by then, you know, four weeks from now or whatever, we should have another leader that has done it at least enough times, or we can swap, have a couple different people do it. And then like, okay, we're gonna do another group. Does somebody want to go do one? Or you guys gonna stay here and then I'll go do one? And just kind of leave that open.

So I mean, the thought is it really just multiplies to the point that, you know, as people catch on and realize that it's really not hard. I I purposefully take less time planning. This was really big with our, it just stopped me at any point. The Tuesday group, I purposely take less less time planning it than I do doing it because it's not a sermon. It's not a, it's just a discussion. And so it, I don't want to take too much time in and planning it because then it'll just be that and less of a discussion. And so when we do it, I just have post-it notes. And this is another thing learned from, I think it may be in T40, but it's definitely something that New Life taught from, whoever that, you know, I wish I could get the original person, really like Bill Smith. He's done a ton.

For us, but the idea of five questions—and it's: what is this? When you're reading through the Bible, what does this say about God? What does it say about people? What does this say about you? What are you going to do about it? And who are you going to share it with?

Those are like five questions, and as I'm reading through the chapters that we're talking about, I just have sticky notes on the side and I literally write "God" with a question mark and I put it on the sticky note like on that section if I feel like that's the section that talks about what is this, what does this say about God? Or if it's a section that's like, oh, this is really weird about people—what does it say about people? Or if it's like kind of deep, it's like, what does it say about you? And then I'll just go through the Bible as we're going and like read the sticky notes and like, this is the section that sticky notes connected to, so I guess read that section. And it takes me that as much time as it takes to just read those chapters I planned for.

We're using—if you know Tim Mackey, he does the Bible Project. Those like, well, he has a group now, the Bible Project, but it was started by Tim Mackey. He was lead pastor at Doulos Hope Church in Portland, and they have animated videos that are like perfect for visually showing stuff. So we'll watch the animated videos. Right now we're going through Acts, so it's Acts 1 through 7. And that was my plan—that we'd get through Acts 1 through 7 because that was what we got through when I did a small group, a young adult small group locally. And so the plan was, okay, since we'd already done this young adult small group locally, it'll be really easy to just do that with the online one and then I don't have to think about it as much. And we were going to do 1 through 7, and I had all these notes. You know, I want to make sure that we don't like run out of content and stuff like that.

We talked through chapter 1. It took us an hour to get through Acts 1. We got through two of my post-it notes, and one of them said "what does it say about God" and one of them said "what does it say about people," and that was literally it. That's all for this. For some herb, that's all we got through for an hour and a half. And it was like, okay, yeah, like it's so easy to think like this is gonna be really hard to do. I can get myself in my head that starting a small group is gonna be a ton of my time and ton of work, and instead it turns into I am reading the Bible actively because I have to think about having questions. And I do that for like what, an extra hour in a week? Like I'd already wanted to do that anyway, and now I have accountability for it, which is great. Because if I have accountability, then I can actively give accountability to other people. And then I'm leading a discussion, which is like easy. I thought I have—I have the next like seven weeks planned at this rate. Like, yeah, planning for one week, and it's like, who knows how long it'll take?

So yeah, it's honestly just—it was—it's really easy. Yeah, you just message people and say, "Do you want to be a part of a small group?" and they were like, "Yeah, you know?" And then, okay. And I also messaged people ahead of time saying, "Would you lead a small group?" I messaged like five people. Nobody wanted to do that. But you lead a small group one time and show them how easy it is and how little you planned—the fact that you hit two post-it notes and that you just read through Acts 1 through whatever.

But what I love what you're doing here is you're modeling. You're giving an example. Yeah, like you're doing abstract ministry. You're first off creating a discipleship system. Yeah. We're also working with video gamers, and we didn't really hit on this—like you're connected to a church, but the church really isn't like backing the ministry, right? This is—oh, right. There's also no fees. I mean, the entire from the beginning, the whole point was that it's literally all free. There's no cost involved at all, and that was intentional from the beginning. But you know, and so you trying to get people from the outside to buy into this vision, to lead a small group, to be part of a discipleship thing—like you have to show an example of what that looks like, you know? It we've been churches who were doing like church online, and you know, well, we can talk about online small groups or discipleship online to a moon. A lot of times, like people have no idea what the concept even is. So your example of "I do, you watch. I do, you help. You do, I help. You do, I watch"—you know, at that four-week turnaround time, but it's even still, that's a great example of, hey, I'm gonna train you to do this. You're gonna become very soon so I can step out and go do something else somewhere else, and so I can help the next group get started. That's awesome.

So of your 50 core, you're really looking at what, like ten or twelve better that are doing a group now? Do you like—and the goal is to release that group, then go start another ten? Is that how you're really starting to know?

So yeah, we have—so we have the core. I'd say as far as our like community goes, people that are chatting regularly, we probably have 50 people, and there's a lot of lurkers. So there's a lot of people that'll pop in every once in a while. We did a survey recently, and yeah, I didn't mention this, so yeah, I'd say originally we were probably about 50/50 Christian, non-Christian. We recently did a survey three years later now, and it was like 95 percent Christian, like identifying as Christian. A lot of those people that are on that list, the first time that they posted in prayer, like they said, "I don't usually do this," you know? And I'd say most of their—like when I think about planting seeds, it's like these people that for the first time they're talking about prayer, they're feeling like this is something that they can relate with, and then they found like a local church, and that was kind of our big push for a long time—was you should find a local family, a local place that you can go to. For some people, that's just not something they're probably going to do, and I get that. But I do feel like a local family is really necessary for a lot of different reasons.

But our—you know, it's how do we make how do we make these things easier for online? Like one of the main reasons I'd want you to find a local place is so you can be in a small group. So if I can like break that barrier down by just doing it online, then okay, and then we'll do that, you know? But that—now that there's a seeing that we've switched to mostly—most of our core group being Christian—then that's really where I felt the drive this year for the first time of like, okay, we're going to go real hard into discipleship then. Because I want you to coast—like this isn't a group for the Christian huddle. It's not just like, yeah, I don't want just people that feel like your goal here is to just talk to other Christians that play games because that's not our—there are groups for that. That's not this group.

And there's also a tendency with doing a small group is that it can become hungry, hungry Christian, where it's just like, I just want more information, and like, oh, like what does this say in Greek and Hebrew? And let you know, it's just like, no, not like, think about this in the term of—and that's why we do this from the beginning. I want you to look at this verse as somebody that would look at this verse for the first time. How do you take this verse and give it to somebody? It's like, why the fifth one is "who are you gonna share it with?" Because verses become new when you think about them in the context of somebody who is new. And like, how do I—how do I give this verse to somebody else if it's something I've heard a thousand times? Have I shared it a thousand times? Like, tweetable, man, that was good. It's like—it's like if it's—yeah, it's like somebody told you this verse so many times, but like, are you giving it to somebody? It is a real thing, and we do tend to just be really cycle, you know? And we're not like, we're not giving it to somebody else. We're just taking it in, you know?

It's the same idea like your cup—like your cup's are overflowing, and it's like, yeah, it's gonna keep being filled. Can you like pour it into—who can you pour into so that you can have an empty cup to like fill it again? And yeah, it's that just that mindset. I think it's really a cultural thing of just that—don't get in this cycle. And I believe it does start like a leadership stage. Like you, from the top down, you have to be intentional in discipleship, or else it just becomes, you know, this has been a really nice lesson, you know, or whatever.

Okay, just real quick before we close, because I imagine that Jeff and I are gonna be having you on again because really this has been just amazing to talk through. And I also want to find out like how the group continues to grow. But Amy—yeah, just to see kind of what happens next with that and see what the Lord is doing in you. Get some quick fun questions before we go. A preferred video game method or system?

Ooh, system. Easy. PC. I made the switch from Xbox a long time ago. When I look back, it's great, and then what was the other one? No, because did you custom build it? Or—well, it's been custom built now. It's like it looks like something out of Iron Man or something. It's all like they're not in a good way. It's the bad Iron Man where it's like the stuff like glued to the side and they're like, you know, stuff is like—yeah, it's really not good. But I'm hoping I'm hoping AMD Ryzen third gen is gonna be great and I can build a new computer because I'm like waiting for that. So yeah, that's—we'll see what that goes.

Cool. All-time favorite game?

Oh boy, I don't like that question. I've like thought about it long and hard and decided that I just don't have any clue. No idea.

Nostalgic game that you love to get lost in?

Ooh, a nostalgia game would probably be Super Mario Bros. Super Mario World, just because there's like so much—we had a—well, now I'm like changing my answer a billion times, but let's stick with that one. We, my family had a thing. It was like, you won't get you another game until you beat the one you have. And Super Mario World had like a percentage thing, and it usually was just you beat the game, you get to the end screen. That I've had a percentage, so it was like, no, you haven't beat it yet. It still says 90 percent or something. I was like, no, I beat Bowser. Like I beat him. And so I had to go find all the hidden stuff. And like there's so many hidden things in that game. There's no way I could do that today without Google, and like I still have no idea how I found like the star road or like how I found special world or zone or whatever. Like I have no idea, but somehow I did that as a kid without a guide. So that game still has like—yeah, I'm like, haha, like you missed that thing because you know, it's like I know I have that whole game like embedded in my brain. So yeah, it's that's the nostalgia thing for me.

Very cool, man. I don't want to put an age on you, but I'm gonna put an age on you. How old are you?

Oh boy. 27.

So you're 27 years old and you decided, hey, I'm gonna start a discipleship ministry on—yeah, for video gaming. Like I just—and I asked I questioned not because you know you're 27, but sure, and that impressive to have to have that heart and that vision to do some non-traditional ministry like this. And so man, I just wanted to encourage you in this. Like you're doing a lot of things that are unconventional. You're doing a discipleship only with no budget, independent outside of a church. Yes, you're—

Work at a church and you're using resources but it sits outside of that church's kind of direction, which is a great church, and you're doing it centered around video game. It's like there's a bunch of stuff that's like, "That's not gonna work, that's not gonna work. Why would you even try that?" Yet strangely, what you're seeing now, even within the past month or so since we've been talking, you're seeing growth and development in those areas. So man, be encouraged by that. That's phenomenal.

Listeners who are out there, man, be like Jate. Not like, play seven hours of Destiny in a row, but if you do, please, and God lead you to have a conversation with somebody, how awesome is that? But no, take a risk. Take a chance. On Facebook a while back it's like, "The Masters failed more than the apprentice has tried." Yeah, and oh dude, that is deep, right? It was on a new health podcast maybe a month or so ago. But get out there and try. Get out there and take a chance. Try something different for the sake of the gospel, for the sake of discipleship, for the sake of the kingdom.

Yes, it's funny you mention that game, Jeff, because you know, there's so many shared experiences that we have that take a long time that don't lead to gospel conversations. I'm like, "No, Jate's a complete advantage of that. So there's no time loss." Like, Lauren and I went to a Red Sox game last week. We were in Boston. We were at a Sox game for like three or four hours. That didn't lead to a gospel conversation afterwards, but man, if it did, that would have been amazing. So many of us out there have seen Avengers Endgame. That's a three-hour block in the movie theater that, if it led to a gospel conversation afterwards, man, that'd be huge.

Jate leveraged a puzzle that brought in a whole lot of people that he wasn't, that he doesn't know, and brought them together in community, and he leveraged that for the sake of the gospel. That's magnificent, man. I say be like Jay, man. Even if it means you're spending three or four hours on the game and you're taking apart puzzles, man, I say be like there. You go, we're all gonna get like "Be Like Jay" tattoos. It's gonna be great.

I don't do that. Yes, I think this last time, but my like my prayer like almost starts and ends with like, "God, you gotta humble me." So I mean, like that is my biggest fear. It's like, "No, I don't want it. I don't want to get like a bloated head about anything." So yeah, do not get my name tattooed. Bad. That mentality, like you're saying, just to end it, is that everything that you do, you know, do it for the glory of God. And so I know somebody is probably listening that's like, "But not this, you know, not this thing that I do." And it's like, "Oh, I mean, what is this?" Well, if it's something you can't do for the glory of God, you probably shouldn't be doing it. Let's put it that way, you know? So you find something, and I don't think that means, you know, that we're gonna have you need to just be singing all the time. If that's what you do, then I mean, good. But like, take the things that you're doing and just think about it a little deeper, you know? How can you find a community in that? And how can you be intentional? Like, that's our word for this year in Love Clan. It's doing the same things you were doing, but you're doing them intentionally.

Yeah, and that's also it. It's just really important for discipleship is intentionality.

Cool. Hey, Jay, if somebody wants to find Love Clan, if somebody wants to find you on social media, more information, where do they go?

Sure, yeah. Love Clan, loveclan.net. I think that still works. I haven't checked it recently. We're on Discord, so I usually send kort.gg/backslash "What is Love Baby Don't Hurt Me," and that's the usual ones that you'd look for if you wanted to find me. I'm Jade Earhart on Facebook, or sometimes I'll use tweets, but for the most part it's just Facebook or Discord. My Discord is Jate pound 0001, so pretty easy muscle if you wanted, you know? And loveclan.net does work as a sweet, at least when we recorded this.

Yeah, supposed to be a link through. So awesome. Well, for Jade, for Ray, my name is Jeff. Man, it's been a great time, and glad y'all could join us, and we'll see you next time on the Church Digital Podcast. Thanks, everybody.