EP266 - Women Streamers, Trolls, and the Struggle of Female Content Creators

Welcome to the Church Digital Podcast. Through this podcast, we'll talk about the technological innovations within the church, but more than that, we'll protect itself. We'll address deeper questions. Is disciple making possible digitally? How should we approach the digital mission field? Can a biblically grounded church operate in digital space? Oh, and where does the metaverse fit into all this? Whether you're a big or small church, an established church or a startup church plant, the Church Digital's goal is to help churches like yours learn to be a multiplying church digitally and physically. Our heart is that churches like yours will discover a newfound focus on disciple making that will revolutionize your church. And now here's your host, Jeff Reed.

All right, hey, welcome to the Church Digital Podcast Twitch Edition. Here we're broadcasting live at this moment. It's Thursday, 3 P.M. Eastern, and we're at TV slash Digital Church Network. We're in season four here of the Church Digital Podcast, Jesus Gamers in Church. We're digging into and exploring the idea of not just digital church but gamer church, one of the fastest growing categories of digital churches, at least in America today. And we're even seeing expansion in gaming churches globally. We've done deep dives into what church looks like, what digital missionaries look like, what culture looks like, just so many different topics we've hit. Even what church looks like inside of video games. Last week we had DJ Soto and Pastor Coco talking about VR MMO Church on the MMO side, where we talked about Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy 14, and what church looks like within FF14. So some good stuff. And I just said FF14 like I actually know what I'm talking about. I really don't. And so this is purely an example of fake it till you make it. Although my daughter just walked out, who is the FF fan, and is waving, so that's a good thing.

Hey, listen, we've got a great show for you today. This is not the show that we were planning on. We had to pivot a little bit. We had promised and talked about earlier a conversation with Dr. Carl from the American Association of Christian Counselors. We were going to do a deep dive on neurodivergency and how to do ministry in some of these areas when you're dealing with some mental challenges and people with some issues like that. And so we were going to have that conversation, and Mark Flute—excuse me, Mark Flute, Sir Mark, however you pronounce the dude's last name—was going to be part of that, and TJ was going to be a part of that from God Squad. And everybody got sick, like sick like COVID. And so Mark and TJ, God bless you, get better. We'll do the conversation at a later time, and I'm excited about that. Even Dr. Carl was excited to jump into this conversation to really explore how to do digital ministry centered around neurodivergent and some mental challenging issues with that. So we are going to do that later, and one day we will actually get Mark's name correctly pronounced. It's been years at this point, man, and I've never done it right. That's embarrassing for me.

We're going to move on here, and we're going to bring in today's show. So we're not going to do the neurodivergent conversation, and instead we're going to make it ladies night here on the Church Digital. We're going to bring on Asia, and I want to bring on Amanda into the conversation. And so Mark, who's actually doing tech with Tobid, is running, and thankfully pressed the right button. So Asia, Amanda, thanks for jumping on the show here.

Thanks for having us.

Great. So I jokingly said it's ladies night. It's actually like three in the afternoon, so it's afternoon. You know, maybe I should say something like girl power or whatever. By the way, this is going to be so awkward for the rest of the show. Like, it's going to be fun. The last concert I actually saw publicly—and this is going to date me right now—that I actually went to a venue and saw, I saw Spice Girls. Their last U.S. concert tour. That's pretty impressive, though. What a good last night. I was working at—yeah, I was working for a radio station, and they had free tickets, and I was just like, I'll go. And so I took my girlfriend, who's not my wife. She didn't even want to go. And so I took two other girls who I was friends with—platonic, nothing weird. But we went to this concert, and then so I'm a college senior, and dude, I was the oldest dude at this show except for like the dads who were like there with the three-year-old girls. And it was the most awkward. Like, I think I left the concert early. I couldn't even stick around. I have no idea what that's going to do with video games, but I got two women, so why not tell the girls story, I guess.

Very cool. And so whatever guests were around are now running at how bad this is. But hey, listen, I want to really dig into what the ladies are doing here in ministry, maybe even talk about what women in streaming and what women in Twitch, what this looks like, what opportunities there are. And so thank you, ladies, for jumping on this and making a quick adjustment to be part of this. But let's dig in. And so Amanda, let's kick it off with you. You're with God Squad, and you know your husband was on previously, and we've talked with him, I think a couple times, really centered around what's happening with God Squad. But it's been a minute, so why don't you give us an update and talk to us a little bit about God Squad the church and what ministry looks like for you guys on Twitch and beyond?

Yeah, so Church and we're a church. We actually just celebrated our seven years, our seventh anniversary of being here on Twitch reaching gamers. Last weekend. And so, yeah, we're a church that solely exists on Twitch and Discord to reach gamers for Jesus. And, you know, our four core values are, you know, we just want to be here to help gamers come to know God, to experience community, to discover their purpose, and make a difference. And really, everything that we do is wrapped around those four core values. And, yeah, it's been exciting. You know, we go live for services on Twitch. We have so much community and fellowship in Discord. And that's really us in a nutshell. But it has been just a joy to be a part of.

So I gotta ask, before we swing over to Asia, seven years is a long time. Like, I've never had the same job for longer than four years. And so like, that's two careers for me. What have you guys like, what has been the drastic change? What did you start doing, and like seven years later it's like, oh no, that's a train wreck, we don't do that anymore? There's got to be something that you've pivoted big time on.

Oh gosh. I don't know why this is the first thing that's popping into my head. We used to do this. It's actually not even that huge. I can't think of anything really big. But the first thing that popped into my head is we actually used to do like, during our services, it was more of like a fun little thing we did. It was like a top ten, like gameplay. It was like a video of like just the community members like epic gameplay. It was like top wins, and people could like submit their gameplay every single week. And then like during service we would vote on like the best one. It was really cool, but like no one ever sent videos. It was like one or two people. So it was like a really cool idea, but it was like really hard to keep doing. And so we decided to stop doing it. And so I don't know why that's the first thing that popped in my head, but there's one example.

Very cool. So lots of change. We're going to get into what kind of some of the stuff that God Squad's doing and really digging with their mandate here in a little bit. We're going to swing over to the other Asia now. Is it appropriate for Asia? Do I have to say Asia the girl? Like, what's what?

No, you can call me Asia. My name is actually Asia.

Okay, so it's not like—so yeah, very cool. So Asia, tell me a little bit about your ministry, what it looks like.

So I always, whenever we have this conversation or this kind of conversation, I get a little bit of imposter syndrome because I don't have like an official ministry at all. But in a sense I do, in the sense that I'm like fulfilling my own personal ministry. But that's kind of getting ahead of myself. I've been doing content creation for the last seven years now, around seven or eight. And my heart has always been to build relationships with people. And I try to do that through just being creative and making food. And those are kind of like the two camps I would hang out in. And I was really like on Instagram a lot and on Facebook and on YouTube. And then, you know, during lockdown in 2020, Luke, or Frostbite as a lot of people in the space know him, he started streaming after I think the Last of Us stream was when we were in college. But he started streaming to connect with people. And then I got really involved with just like his community that he started growing. And through that, everyone in that community really encouraged me to like start streaming on my own. And it was one of those like, I don't know, like everything kind of came together where I was like, this is like what I've been wanting to do. I just really have a heart for like I said, building relationships. And like, in the way that I operate, like whatever I create content-wise is just the like the vehicle to, or like the catalyst for those relationships. And I started viewing my channel and my—we were joking about this—but my laundry room is like an extension, like a virtual extension of my home, because I'm all about like hospitality in the sense of I want people to feel at home with me, wherever, whether that is like in a physical home or in the digital space or just grabbing coffee or whatever. Like, I always want people to feel comforted and safe and like have an environment where we can build relationships together. And so it's been really cool over the last a little over two years, kind of like iterating on that and really focusing in on like that perspective and like really connecting with people that I wouldn't be able to if it wasn't for being on Twitch. So anyways, it's been awesome. It's been a joy.

Yeah, yeah, I totally want to get into content creation. And we've not, I mean, we haven't had like a dedicated content creator in this season yet. But I mean, lots of people create content at some level. But like, before we get there, I just want to call out, if you're watching this on YouTube or obviously on Twitch, there's a washer and dryer literally behind you right now. Like, your backdrop is like, are those working machines?

They are. They are. We like to joke around about these machines. They're like fancy big massive speakers, but really they're just a washing machine and a dryer. And they work great. We got them from a scratch and dent store. And yeah, that's this. It's just too big. This room is too big for it to just be a laundry room. And I was like, you know what, I can either like stream from like, I don't know, from like a corner in the dining room or in Luke's like in our living room, our temporary living room that is also Luke's dream room. I was like, I could just also use a space and I feel like I made it look cool. So yeah.

Do you find yourself like doing a random load of laundry like real quick while you're working, or you know, you spill something on your socks and just rip them off and throw them in?

them off and throw them in by himself like it's convenient, right? It is, it is very convenient. I do laundry here and there when I'm working, but the funniest thing actually, also my light all of a sudden started, decided to start flashing, but um, yeah, exactly, exactly. Hopefully it'll stop in a second or else I'll have to do something. But I have an on-air like little LED sign that hangs above that door that's coming from our kitchen, and I have to turn it on or else my brother or Luke will like walk in with just like a load of laundry maybe while I'm streaming or in like a work meeting or something. And there were just too many embarrassing moments for them where they just found themselves in awkward positions looking at my coworkers, maybe not like fully presentable to the public. And so I had to like put a light to indicate like right now it's on, so my brother knows to not like come in here with a little whites or something while we're doing the stream.

Okay, that's awesome. Let's hear a little bit. It's interesting. Saint Bear brings up a great point in Twitch or in chat here. Twitch does not have to be about video games. Food streams, crafts, creativity, coworking, et cetera, are all awesome outside of the box ways to build relationships through digital tools. In Asia, as I recall, you're what you're focused on isn't necessarily video games, right? Like, let's talk a little bit about the heart of some of this content that you're digging into.

Yeah, so my mission is just to like create a hospitable environment for people to build relationships with me and with each other, whoever is like coming into this virtual space. And so everything we do, I try to keep it like chill and vibey. So we do a lot of coworking streams for people that are working from home or you know like just have the capability to have Twitch up or something while they're working or studying, just to create like a shared workspace. Also do sewing sometimes and digital art and cooking. Sometimes I'll be on the other side of the store doing cooking streams just to like make people feel like they're coming into the living room with me or around the dining table or something, to build those friendships. And I'm a terrible gamer. Like, I really enjoy puzzle games. I do enjoy those puzzle games and Sim type games. I like those a lot. But when it comes to like anything FPS or anything, I'm just like terrible, and I'd rather just build my dream home in Sims and hang out with you than like try to probably be carried in Destiny. So but yeah, that's kind of our aim, or my aim whenever I am streaming.

So like you don't have a specific topic? Like, you know, I'm hearing some of the guys and some of the others talking about, oh, I only play this game, and you know, exactly. Yeah, no, so you're just kind of broad. Yes, true, a true variety streamer. That's I really lean into that.

How do you stream in your kitchen? Like, because you're cooking, right? So what does that look like?

I use for all my streams, and I feel like really shines when I'm doing cooking streams. I use a software called Switcher Studio. It's actually the company I work for full-time. I do all my streaming stuff like as kind of like part of my job, but then also like off the clock. And so I'm able to have a pretty simple wireless setup with my iOS devices cameras, and so it's like easy for me to move everything from here into the kitchen and I don't know, make an omelette or something, hang out with people. But yeah, it's fun.

Yeah, I had forgotten that you were at Switcher Studio. Like, that was, I've had several friends that were that actually still are using that. And so it's a great low-cost simple solution. Yeah, small spaces. Like you can really do some really powerful stuff with that. And so that's beautiful. Like you're creating, you're creating content, connecting with people, you're streaming in the kitchen and cooking and all that fun stuff. So let's talk here. I mean, you're both ladies. Thank you. That was awkward. So let's talk here. Like, are your audience women? Do you feel like when you're on, you cater more to women? That women are more wanting to connect with you in those environments? You know, and even God Squad's more of a church, like the representation of a woman involved in that and others. What's the role? What's the purpose? Do you find purpose in being a woman in this space?

Hmm, start. I don't know. We had really good conversations about this, just me and Amanda in the past. Yeah, all right. Well, at least for me, like my audience, I feel like it is mixed. I feel like I'll just naturally connect with women more. I tend to be kind of girly, you know, so I think I'll just naturally connect with women easier. But at least for my streams, I don't stream on my personal channel. I stream weekly on the church channel, and those are definitely mixed, just hanging out, playing different games, whatever I'm feeling like on that day. But yeah, I love the opportunity to be a woman in this space because it's got its own, it's got different types of challenges, right? Where everyone has challenges that they face when going live or doing whatever, you know, but we as women have our own unique challenges. And I love to be able to be an example. I find a lot of purpose in that, just to encourage women, you know, that they can do it too, that they can step out, be a light, be a leader in the space. And yeah, I find a lot of purpose in that, and I just want to do whatever I can to help other women kind of find that encouragement, that empowerment, that push, you know, if they've been feeling to do something, to go ahead and do it, you know? Like, you're awesome. Like, you have amazing things to bring to the table. And we do, we need more women to step up. And so I just like being in this position to be able to yeah, encourage other women and just to be an example. At least that's my hope, to be an example in some way.

So I think you do great. Yeah, I mean, similar to what Amanda said, I definitely find purpose in, or I appreciate the unique perspective, bringing that unique perspective to a space like this. I'm very big on like not existing in a vacuum. And so my desire is not necessarily to focus only on like a specific demographic of people or like just women or women of color or whatever, but my hope is that we can celebrate diversity. And part of that is just like acknowledging, you know, blind spots that people may have. And so being able to have those conversations, either like amongst content creators or like me and Amanda have had really great conversations, or just talking to other people about this topic, I think it just helps people broaden their perspective of how to serve the people that they are serving in their context and capacity. And that doesn't mean, like, at least for me, like I just don't like to shoe in on one group of people. But yeah, like I think that it's like both an effect where we're encouraging and supporting other women in the space to empower them all to do the things that you know, the Lord called them to do.

So yeah, yeah, you know, it's 2023. Do you still feel the male machismo, you know, ego in gaming and even moving beyond gaming in Twitch, within the communities there? Like, is there still kind of that intolerant approach, or has culture started to shift within Twitch overall recently where it is more accepting and empowering?

I yeah, I've definitely seen it improving for sure. I think that we've come a long way. I mean, I think that there will always be those people, and I don't think that we're a hundred percent there yet. But I think we've made a lot of progress. I think there will always be, you know, those guys, whether they realize they're doing it or not. They're kind of like stuck in their own ways and unintentionally still create this barrier between men and women. And I experience that a lot. Honestly, I experienced that more on the unintentional side where they just are unaware of just like behaviors and habits that they have that just naturally create this barrier that make it harder for women. But I really do think we've come a long way. So yeah, I think, yeah, yeah, I agree with that. Like, I would say I think, like, you know, people always be crazy or just can't be crazy. I think like overall there is like a positive shift where women are, there's like more inclusion in the digital space. But I would also agree that a lot of it is more subtle. And the experiences that I've had, it's hard to say because like there's the big, we can talk about the space in general or we can talk about like in the niche Christian community of streamers. I think what's very my experience is that a lot of times like I feel like this weird draw that I feel like I need to like prove myself sometimes. And I feel like my light just keeps deciding to change weirdly. Whatever, it's fine. I find once again I think this is like a very subconscious thing that people aren't purposely doing. But in the Christian creators space in particular, a lot of times like when people find out who my husband is and they're like, oh, okay, okay, and then like I've like whatever hit some benchmark that they were expecting. What, like I said, I don't think it's on purpose. And this is not saying everyone does this. I just have noticed this. Whereas, you know, if people don't know my connection to Luke or to Love Thy Nerd, which is the organization that we are both connected in, there's like a little bit of a disconnect there. And I feel bad because I know that there are other women that are in the same position as me but are not, they don't have a significant other that is you know tied to this community. And I think it's just that much harder for them to feel connected and feel seen in the space. So that's kind of like where my burden is.

Sure, yeah, I feel that. I feel that. You know, Saint Bear's in chat right now and he's talking about you know specifically Amanda. Like, you're not just a streamer. You lead this, you lead the organization with God Squad and very influential within that. And the flip side is he's talking about Aki who's on the show. And you know, we talked about how Peach is part of streaming and setting an example for other female streamers. Like Peach, who, just out of pure ignorance on my side because I'm fake it until you make it, I don't, I'm not a gamer. Who are some other people in this space? Some other female voices that we should be looking at that are having a powerful influence, a positive influence within culture?

I'll say, um, off the top of my head, mainly because I've been connecting with these specific ladies lately, but Miss Positivity is great. And I heard, I'm not an FPS gamer myself, so like, yeah, that's what I hear, you know, if you shoot and kill the things, like I'm happy for you. But I hear that she's actually cracked. But she's just so awesome. Miss Positivity, her, Shades Crossing, Tommy Cesare, you, or just some incredible women in the space that are so encouraging and they just want to uplift and empower other people. And I just loved getting to know them. So those are a few that I would say.

Yeah, I would say I'm going to shout out, she probably would hate that I did this, but like I really love the like behind the scenes women that are getting stuff done in the space. Kate Katawaki, she is one of the cofounder of

Love by nerd and she's just, I mean I guess she does. She is on stream like once a week because she helps record a podcast. Um, and so you can get a little more face time with her there, but for the most part she works behind the scenes and she just says very intentionally creating content to encourage and sharpen believers in this space and also like create a bridge to, for those who are not believers in the space and who just, you know, need the love of Jesus. So um, all the love to her. Yeah, that's so cool.

You know, it's really interesting to see. Well, let me ask it this way. You know, we talk a lot about contextualization in digital ministry, right? Where, you know, like the digital missionaries, I'm thinking Jake, Jake is going to reach the people that Jade's going to reach, and Jake as a digital missionary, his context is completely different than Aki. Aki is going to reach more of a family person. Jake is interested in Asian influence, like the hybrid fusion, whatever thing that Jake works. But it's Jake, you know, you can't explain it, but it's who Jade is. But there's different contexts. Um, I'm curious when you look at like women streaming, some of the names you just mentioned, yourself included, yourselves included, do you find that there are specific audiences that you can reach into that maybe a male counterpart can't? Um, similarly, are there guys, you know, is there a target audience for them? Is there a persona that they can reach that maybe you can't get into? Like talk to me about some of that. The challenges within that relationship. Is there a persona that you can reach that a male can't, vice versa?

Um, speaking as a woman of color, um, I am really appreciative of like the unique space, a unique voice that I can have in the space and the kind of community that I've fostered. But it's been a privilege to help foster. Um, is just people who don't feel like, so I'm mixed. I have a like an interesting upbringing, and so I've always felt like I didn't really fit into a specific box. Really. Um, and that kind of just became more intensified like moving to the states and like doing life here and not in a bad way. Like it just kind of the reality of life. Um, and so it's been really cool to yeah, to like talk about those things and help people feel seen and at home when they feel like they don't quite fit in. And I don't think that's like unique to me. Like I think that other people can definitely do that. But I think that like, um, embracing those differences, like embracing the fact that we're not the norm of this digital space, helps me connect with, um, yeah, people who feel like they don't fit in in those circles.

And like I have seen, like you said, like people are all wired differently, and I'm not the person who is going to be like the entertainer person on screen. Like I'm not like trying to constantly catch your attention with like epic skills or whatever, or like a big personality. And so like a lot of times like I will miss out on people who really do want to be like hooked into whatever, like, um, to really entertaining content constantly. But for the people that like need a little bit of rest and they just need a little bit of relaxation because their whole lives are all crazy and they just like want to decompress, like I feel like that is the circle of people that I keep finding in my community, which I'm here for. Um, and so yeah, I would say that like, um, there are, whether it's like women or men or just different personalities, like I think we all serve in this space in like very unique ways. And so I think it's really, I think you made a good point of saying like that people have different audiences, and I think it's good to like not, I mean I think it's okay to like observe and like how people are doing things, but to not compare, judge like one community against another, and like try to like figure out how to replicate someone else's community necessarily.

Yeah, what do you think, Amanda? Um, from my experience, I know that, you know, there is like we've been talking about it. There is like this, um, I guess this wall in between like women creators and men creators, or men and women in the space. And um, one of the reasons behind it is like just the world we live in. Like women have to be more on guard like to protect themselves because like we live in a crazy world. We know the internet is crazy too. Like a lot of these women who are like streaming or you know, content creating, whatever, like they have like whispers and DMs turned off just because of like, you know, all just the crap that they continually get from just the crazy world that we live in. And so you know, for me, like it's easier for women to connect with women because we feel safer with each other. So to me that's been a very unique opportunity that I've been more so discovering lately that I have this opportunity to help connect with these women and to help them connect with other people. And you know, I've gotten to know a lot of just really great men in the platform through God Squad church that are just really great guys. They're good people, you know, and to help kind of bridge that gap, you know, bridge that because like if they're trying to connect with them but they're like, I don't know you, like stranger danger, stay away, you know, it's going to be harder for them to connect because you know, just by natural default women are just more on guard, you know, if you're a strange man like reaching out, like they're not going to be very quick to answer your DM. And that's just the way it is. Um, and so I've loved being in this position to be able to kind of help you know, bridge those gaps and to connect with these women. And you know, I have loved, you know, just learning to step into that to yeah, just to help more connection happen.

And so sure, I'm not looking for detail unless you're comfortable, but I do want to ask like, have you experienced, um, awkward, difficult, bad situations personally in church context, in DMs? Like has that even invaded within the church context that you're operating in, Amanda?

Oh, 100 percent. Which title, you know, doesn't stop people. Um, I was telling Asia of a story I won't tell the details, but like I was like live streaming on our church channel, which says God Squad church, and I had this guy come in chat saying these, you know, interesting things. And I was like, wow, like even on a church channel I'm not safe. Um, and for me, like it is unfortunate. Like I have just, you know, it's just the way we're the world we live in. And so it, you know, it bothers me, but it doesn't bother me. But yeah, like even in the church, you know, a Discord on Twitch, it's open to everyone at any time, you know, and you're just gonna get some messages.

I'm laughing not at you. My heart goes out for you. And I'm going to go into this, but evidently, Lux, I'm finding in chat, somebody went into Lux's church service last night and asked for a sex tape of, um, Mark and his wife, which I just said on the podcast. So that's that's horrible and horrendous.

I was gonna say awesome at the same time, but it's really not awesome.

Yeah, um, not at all. What, let me like, I want to dig into this because I mean, Twitch is open and so we're letting the world in. We're doing church where the world is. You're going to get crap like that that happens. Forgive me, crap. If perhaps an issue. Um, but what, literally, how do you protect yourself from those situations? Like, I'm there's an administrative way to kick them out. There's a mute button. Um, how does it prevent them from coming back in? Who are people that like you've got teams of volunteers that moderate? Like, what safeguards are in place to stop this from happening or prevent this from happening?

Um, I think they're just to this for sure. Um, I have found that like, um, for personally, I just don't see timing out all as like effective. Um, I think like if it is like a bannable situation, like I will just ban. But that being said, I think it's really important that like that there is nuance to um, to those approaches because you know, as we're like building community, if it's like someone random that I haven't like, I have no like context for, like I honestly don't feel bad like just not acknowledging them and banning them and not saying anything. Um, but if it's like inappropriate conversation that is being brought up by someone that we have like developed um, some sort of like rapport, friendship with, um, I try to like have, I think actually saying bearer has been there for some of them, like just try to have a conversation to reason out of like, hey, like I just don't think like kind of come alongside. I don't think it's appropriate for like, I'm confident myself to not have to like shut you down right away. Like I don't need to like, you know, go there right away. But I do want to have a conversation if you're bringing this up, um, like on stream. Um, we can talk about like, hey, like I don't think it's appropriate, or hey, maybe we should think through what we're talking about. But I feel like those kind of conversations just generally speaking only have stock if there is some sort of like a relationship there. So if I don't have the relationship with people, like I will disband, and then like, you know, if like if one of my mods, these days like my mods are pretty busy, so I'm like kind of by myself a little bit, or Luke is just Luke or something. Um, and so like people can reach out to our mod team if they, you know, want to appeal for whatever reason. Um, but yeah, so that's the way I try to approach it. Like I try to treat people as people as much as possible if there is like a relationship there. But that's just my own approach though.

Unpack for me now. We're Twitch streaming this, and so Twitch people understand what you just said. But my podcast audience is not as comfortable with Twitch. And so I want you to unpack mod team. Like you just said, my mod team handles this, or like appeals and stuff like that. Explain what mod team is. That's an interesting concept. I want them to understand.

Yeah, um, I think Saint bear mentioned this in chat as well, that like a lot of women have like bigger mod teams than, um, men who are like content creators on Twitch, or I'm sure are like on other platforms. Um, but um, for me, it's like important to have people that like show some sort of like commitment to your community, whether that means like they're watching your streams constantly or they're in your Discord server or whatever. Um, it's like in our best, in like the community's best interest to have like some people appointed that have like a little bit of power in your chat to, um, to remove people from your streams at like the most extreme, or to mute certain chatters if people are being inappropriate or do other positive things. Like they don't just do negative things. Like they can also, um, have like a positive effect in your channel. But I think that it's important to, um, it's like on one hand you're protecting your own self. If someone is like making, if someone is like, um, not haggling, that's the wrong word. Heckling you and, um, making, I don't know, just like teasing you or at or just like being completely inappropriate. Um, you want to protect yourself. But also you want to protect your community. Um, like they don't need to hear that either. Like it's not just you. Um, I think that that's a responsibility we have as like people who are hosting streams, that like you're also trying to be considerate of the people that are in your chat. Um, so mod teams can help you just keep the community safe.

House rules in order I guess, but I mean I'm sure like it's more a little bit more robust with God Squad, but that's just my own disorganized approach. Yeah, I'd love to hear kind of God Squad's approach, um, how you maybe modifying some of those ideas, and I'm assuming all these are volunteers, right? Like is there a page structure for me? Yeah, for sure. No, no, I mean I think you can pay your mods. I know there's some like streamers that like you can, uh, any like, yeah, any like sub money they get or whatever they can like give that all. I've seen people that like they make their money like through partnerships or whatever, so whatever money they get through Twitch they just give to their mods, which I think is really cool. Um, but yeah, man, to talk a little bit about mods. Yeah, so for us, um, you know, we obviously have our staff, um, who is there for that, but we do we have a volunteer team of moderators as well. Um, for us being a church, uh, we always resort to banning as like our last resort. It's not something that we're ever quick to do. We always try to leave that as like our last option, um, because we believe trolls need Jesus too. Um, and so we do, we try to have conversations with them. Um, you know, for me, uh, my one of my old mods when I used to stream my own personal channel, um, she shared a chat, but even even now streaming on my personal channel or the church channel, um, if I have someone coming in my chat, you know, saying inappropriate things, I have no problem calling them out. I'm gonna call them out. Um, you know, and I'm gonna be like, hey, you know, I'm glad you're here. I hope you're having a great day, but please be, you know, kind and respectful. Um, you know, and if they continue, I will time them out, but I do, I confront them and I give them a chance. And our moderator team is so patient, and they're always willing to talk with these people. There is a line, you know, of course, that you know, once they cross the line, then yes, we remove permissions, we ban, we block, you know, whatever. Um, but we really try, you know, to exhaust all of our options, um, before we resort to banning someone from the community, just because as a church, you know, we do, we try hard to reach people for Jesus. We're here on Twitch to reach people for Jesus, and these are the people on Twitch. Um, and so that's kind of our approach, but it is, it's very similar, you know, we have a mod team, you know, bots are very helpful, you know, in things like Discord and Twitch chats. Um, you know, for auto modding through those bots, um, but yeah, and so that's that's kind of our approach in a nutshell is we we try to not ban unless it's absolutely necessary.

But yeah, future generations, like the next level of of women that that want to stream, the the ones that are just starting out, how do you prepare them for this? How do you help them be aware of the difficult, the tense situations, the trolls that like that? Um, what does that look like? Do y'all have any experience with that?

Yeah, I mean I think like part of it is just like feeling or like having the confidence to have these kinds of conversations. I think like this is a, uh, obviously people being trolls is not unique to just girls, but I feel like there is a unique struggle, uh, that women have in the space that just I don't know, like it's one of those like, if you experience it, you know it. If not, like it's hard, it's hard to like to fully like put yourself in those shoes. Yeah, if you know, you know, in the worst way, um, and in the best way too. But like, um, um, I think like, yeah, being like having a an air of um transparency, uh, when these things happen, uh, I think is like very encouraging, um, and it helps make other women in the space feel less isolated because, um, I mean, me and Amanda met for the first time in person, um, at the Megazord event, and we just like quickly connected and a big way, like instant way. We've connected with just realizing that like we both had very similar experiences in, um, this like mostly positive, like, um, gaming, uh, like Christian content creating gaming space, um, but it was interesting to find like, oh, it was one of those like, oh, you too? I thought it was just me. And like, you know, when most of the people in the circle are guys and uh, just don't have the same experiences as us, you kind of think that you're on your own and you just gotta figure it out and like, you know, just keep going. Um, and I mean, there's there is an element for sure of just like being resilient, uh, that you have to have if you're in the space, but it like we also are human and like, uh, we have the ability to connect with each other because we are human, uh, and so I think it's just like important to be open to have those conversations and and like seek them out. Like I think like just being intentional goes a long way. Um, but yeah, and I feel like I'm rambling, Amanda. Like I'd love your take on this. Go ahead.

Yeah, honestly, I I have to agree with my girl Asia. She said a lot of good stuff. And, um, um, you know, I I agree. I think it's just helping them understanding like what they're getting into. Like, not that it's like you got to prepare yourself because like, you know, this is this is no joke, but you know, there is like the Internet is just a different place and you know, you just have to understand what you're getting into and you know, have that confidence. I love that word, confidence, that you used, Asia, um, to be able to navigate that, you know, the confidence that you know, the people that come into your chat like they don't define you. Um, and you know, learning to navigate that, but then also again to what Asia said, you know, the importance of we need each other. We were created for community. We were created for relationship, and finding that network of people that you can, you know, go to for encouragement, um, for advice, um, for prayer, you know, as you're stepping into this space is so necessary as well. Um, and so yeah, for anyone who's starting new, like I would want them to understand like what they're getting into and like, you know, to understand to have the confidence to step into it, but also like, you know, we need each other, you know, so make sure you find people that you can have in your life to walk alongside you in this journey.

So, hmm, yeah, so good. Yeah, and like I was saying, that the peer-to-peer network, the peer-to-peer connection, uh, walking with somebody that's going through it, you're right, Amanda, that's so helpful, um, to be open and transparent, even as as Asia was saying. Awesome. Well, hey, listen, we we were joking in chat on today was like, uh, love your mod day. That was that was a deep deep dive on some of that. Um, talk to me, you know, because we've been a little negative and a little down here. What brings you the most joy in in streaming? Like, why do you why do you do this? What's what's the uh, what's the thing that you love about what you're doing? Go ahead, Asia.

Great question. Okay, well, I never know of like I want to like anticipate the delay and not cut someone off, but then it's just like a more a longer silence. Um, but I mean, so much brings me joy. I think like, um, specifically streaming this kind of content, it it makes me feel the most whole, I guess, because like, there is a there is a side of me that is very creative, and I like to, yeah, create things, uh, no matter what the medium is, but I love like building relationships. And so it's really cool to come alongside other people while we're like creating something together and, um, just catch up on life and but in particular, I think like some of the things I love is just like, you know, over time, people becoming like names on in chat becoming familiar faces virtually, I guess, like people that, um, you know, you you know that they've been really struggling in math and they're super excited that they got an A on their last test they studied for, or, um, like knowing like people's, um, uh, like, uh, celebrations or struggles, whatever they may be, like just getting to know people beyond just like them saying hi and in chat and whatever, uh, like I I think like one of the sweetest moments is, um, whenever people, uh, there are viewers that you know, they haven't been in stream for a while, for whatever reason, there's not to be a bad reason, uh, but when they come back, it always feels like a little reunion. Um, I just think like that's one of the sweetest things that like we can like see each other, even if we're in a virtual space, uh, yeah, I just love that. It makes it feel like it's like a real community and like I essentially am having these people in my home with me hanging out and doing life together. So yeah, it's sweet. It's awesome.

I think for me, um, I I have two main things, and the first one would be, you know, streaming honestly is just a tiny tiny part of what I do through God Squad Church. Um, you know, it's two hours of my entire, I do too much stuff. Um, but that's the church life. Um, but well, it should have been, but anyways, that's a whole other conversation. Um, but I, uh, I honestly genuinely just love seeing people's lives being transformed by Jesus. Um, you know, I have the opportunity and privilege to lead small groups. I actually just had one before this podcast, and, um, you know, leading worship, you know, being on stream, just having those random conversations with people and seeing people's lives changed and being a part of that, uh, it brings a joy that is unexplainable. Um, it really is just so incredible. And so for me, that would be one. The other one would be, um, just experiencing community, like developing relationship, people online, and Asia, like you are you are one of those people. Um, you know, that I've had the opportunity to get to know and to connect with. Um, yes, you know, but getting to know people, building relationships, and having that community. Um, you know, it is like, it's it's online, you know, that is true, but it is still so good and it has been so life-giving. And so I think those two things have been just a huge source of joy for me is, yeah, I just, it's truly a privilege to be able to be here in this space.

So it's interesting, uh, Amanda, you were you know, talking a little bit about you know, the church life and and so much other things that that you're involved in, and you're you you know, recently you've you've been more active in in leading the the organization, like even at that level as the leader of of a church and and a female, are are you feeling tension? Are you feeling kickback or issues with with being a female leader? Like you talk to me a little bit about that.

Oh yes. Um, so I'm a pastor at our church. Um, and you know, not everyone believes that women can be or should be pastors, you know, which is okay. You know, they're they're they can believe what they want. I believe it is okay. Yes, I am. Um, and so yeah, I definitely get pushback. We would literally have people join our Discord server, and you know, I'll be showing online, and so at the top right, you know, we have our staff at the top right, and you know, it has my name and then parentheses, it has pastor. I will literally just get someone who is brand new to our server who will just DM me like the second Timothy verses and then like almost like a drop like moment, and then they'll leave our server. And like, I've heard that before. Yeah, like, honestly, I get that so much, and I'm like, okay, like, what I bet you thought you did something there. Um, you know, and so it's just, you know, stuff like that is a normal occurrence. And you know, honestly, in the beginning, I was like, nah, maybe I shouldn't be a pastor. I don't want to stir the waters. But at the same time, I'm like, you know, I've I've grown in my confidence in what God has called me to, and I'm at a point where I'm like, you know, people are going to be people, and you know, that's okay, because you know, I'm walking in the calling that God has called for me. And I'm truly learning to be confident in that, not in myself, but in what God has called me to do. And so but yeah, total pushback for sure. You know, I would love you just

Said Amanda, "You said two or three times what God has called you to do. I would—can you do this? Can you like tell me right now what you feel like God's called you to do? I would love to hear that."

"Oh gosh, um, well that's such a hard question to answer because, you know, also I could go on about this, but I also feel like, you know, God calls us to seasons. Like he calls us into new positions, opportunities, you know, et cetera, et cetera, in different seasons. And so for this season, um, you know, I do—I feel like God has called me, uh, well, it's also been a long season. I've been with the church for seven years, so it's been a long season. But you know, I feel like God has called me to be a leader, you know, for God Squad Church. Um, and you know, specifically that started as worship ministry. And so it's what I went to college for. And you know, the worship and executive pastor. And so, um, but it started specifically with worship, and that's kind of grown. Um, and I've learned as I've learned more about myself and the gifts that God has given me, that's kind of grown into this worship and executive position. Um, and I just—I just love it. It is just so fun. But yeah, like I don't know how to answer that. It's so packed. Um, but I don't know if that answered it actually, but, um, yeah, I don't know."

"No, I love it. Like, listen, it's—it's culture puts women in a difficult position, um, you know, where you're unable to lead, where there's hesitancy to lead, uh, you're marginalized, you're discredited, you're thrown aside. Uh, I mean, shoot, this goes all the way back to biblical times. The woman at the well, Mary Magdalene, uh, very mother of Jesus. Like, there's—and I just offended a whole bunch of Protestants because of the Catholic reference, so forgive me. But you understand the point where the women are discredited in many ways, whereas the first people that saw Jesus were women. Some of the more influential people, you know, let's not even talk about Esther and Ruth and the of the Old Testament. Like, there's incredible power that that comes from, uh, from the female side of biology. And so we as a church, we need to understand, we need to live in that tension of, yeah, the Bible says this, but we're seeing this. And having that tension, I don't know, it's a bad thing. There's a lot of other tension areas in the Bible that that we need to dig into as we're seeing culture shift and adapt with some things. So listen, I love this conversation, and I'm seeing even Mother Goose has been saying four and five times in chat, 'This is awesome, this is incredible, I love this.' Um, because—and I'm gonna make an assumption here that Mother Goose is a woman because her name's Mother. Uh, maybe that's wrong, but—and I think so. Uh, is Mother a woman? Like, she can yell at me right now on chat if she's not. But they're even talking about this, gives, uh, is empowers other women to be transparent with what they're going through and get it addressed and get on top of it. Um, yeah, I have like such a burden strong in their face. No, I was going to say Mother Goose. I can tell these ladies are strong in their face. All right, now go ahead, Asia. Talk to me."

"I mean, I just have a burden for, for specifically, um, like, yeah, women who want to follow, like, want to be faithful to the calling that God specifically has called them to, especially when, like, you know, this doesn't speak for obviously every single Christian woman, but like, I think there are a good amount of people in this space in, like, the Christian church in general who were, you know, raised by families who, um, wanted them to be, you know, be discerning, to be faithful to the Lord and, uh, to what he's called us to. And I think that, like, when you get, you become an adult and you're like in the world and trying to do that, you're in, you end up being like met with so much weird opposition or just like weird tension when you're literally just like trying to be faithful to, yeah, what God has called you to. And, um, and I just, uh, my heart just goes out, uh, for I mean for everyone that are like dying to follow the Lord's calling, but specifically like I think women just having a hard time like feeling comfortable doing what what like they are convicted to do by the Lord and like faithfully trying to serve in whatever way they can. Um, yeah, so I don't know. I just my heart is for for all all of them, all of us."

"Hmm, so what's what's next for your respective ministries? Like, we've probably talked more about the women issue than your than your ministries, but but I'd love to know what's coming up with God's God Squad, what's coming up with, um, the content creation and and stuff that that you're working on, Asia. But let's let's do Amanda first. Amanda, what's what's on the horizon? What what can we expect to see from God Squad Church?"

"Um, so some things that we're doing next, well, first we have, um, our Easter services. And so we have, um, an awesome Easter service planned for next Saturday. Um, so we're really excited for that. We're doing like a big invite challenge, encouraging our community to invite people to church. You know, we're going to be doing gaming monitor giveaways at full services. And so, um, that's—yeah, we try to go all out for the big, you know, for the big, you know, Easter, Christmas, you know. Um, and so we have our Easter services. We're doing a three-day stream-a-thon, um, at the end of April, announcing, um, our digital missionaries that we're going to be taking on as a church. We're going to be financially supporting, um, three individuals within this online gaming space that are just reaching people for Jesus. And so, you know, that's coming up. We're bringing back our Squad Con in person this year, um, which is like a three-day event where we come together for like live worship, fellowship, all of that fun stuff. Um, so we're bringing that back, and so we have a we have a good year in store for God Squad Church and a lot of awesome—yeah, so I'm excited."

"When is Squad Con?"

"Uh, well, we're still in the process. It's gonna be in the summer, but it's—we're—it's gonna be about end of July, beginning of August. I'm currently in conversation with a venue, and so more details to come. But yeah, I I want to have you on the podcast. I want to bring you back and bring TJ or whoever whoever you want to come back. But I I want to I want to unpack what happens when God Squad Church meets physical. Like, you know, so often you digital churches, the assumption digital can't be physical, which is interesting because you can be physical. It's you're just not physical every week. And so even meeting, yeah, um, once a year, God Squad doing Squad Con, like that's a great opportunity to build the relationships physically that'll that'll connect it and extend it through digitally. Like, so I I would love—and I'm sure some great stories gonna come from that—so we'd love to unpack that summer, fall. So I'll I'll make a note. We'll I'll, uh, reach out to you. It'll be great. Um, all right, so Asia, talk to me a little bit. What's what's on the road map for you?"

"Yeah, um, so I mean, I feel like our my streams will still be pretty similar. I'm having a bit of a schedule change just due to like my own work stuff. And, um, so we'll just keep some of that same content. But, um, I'm in a unique position where Luke and I both, uh, Frostbite Ivy as he goes by on Twitch, uh, we both, um, do like have our own personal, um, channels and ministries and like focus social media effort in tandem. Uh, and and we also share Discord server. And so I really want to focus, or I have been like focusing on, um, coming up with a plan to be really intentional with our shared Discord server and creating digital spaces off of Twitch, but like in in another like focus space, uh, to, um, hang out like virtually, whether that is like more just like getting work done together or having some movie nights, just like more times for us to like, um, have shared time together where we're not so like live on a channel and it can be a little bit more intimate in that way. So I'm really excited about that. And, um, I think with like, I actually think with this my schedule changing because of work, it ends up enabling me to be a little bit more involved in our Discord server, which is super awesome. And because that's where our heart has been is like really having a collected effort, so it's cool to, yeah, to share that with Luke and have our communities come together. That that's a good example of like two communities that are very different, but they, uh, work really well together. Uh, but yeah, so I'm excited for what that will all turn into. In addition to like all the stuff that Luke is doing for Love Thy Nerd, uh, with, um, the, uh, nerd mission summit. Oh, I already butchered the name. NCMS Summit. But, uh, but, uh, there's just a lot going on right now, and it's all really good thing. So just being able to focus and hone in on the specific areas will be awesome. Um, but yeah."

"Awesome. Well, very cool. Listen, I I've loved this conversation, even even just getting a a better taste, a um, some examples and some stories of maybe some of the difficulties that that, uh, that women streamers and even women in church are going through. And so, you know, I want to take a a moment here and, uh, and thank you all for for doing this, for for pioneering, for, uh, carving the path for those that come behind, for setting an example for others, uh, to follow suit. You know, it really is a shame to quote Saint Bear in chat right now, uh, that you all are going through the situation that you have, this difficulties that that you that you have to gear up for trolls at a higher level, that you you get people joining a Discord server just to throw a Bible verse in your face and run away like a coward. Uh, yes, I said that. And so listen, it and for for those of us that are on the side watching, um, and like your mods, however we can help in that situation, we we want to. But I want to take a moment and to thank you for for the difficulties because you are setting an example for that next group that that that's coming behind you. So thank you for that. And and maybe it's it's you know, love your mod day, and it's it's respect the women who are on this day, and we can we can make it whatever days we want like it's it's whatever. But let me ask you this, you know, it's just as we're landing the plane, as we're wrapping up here, any closing thoughts? Um, at age, any closing thoughts as we're wrapping up?"

"Um, I just am always encouraged to, or I don't know, just it's awesome to have these kinds of conversations. And, um, like, you know, not not for the sake of like speaking into, um, a vacuum or, you know, just like talking to the same people about the same topics. Um, I think it's just really interesting that it is actually life-giving, like the conversations that me and Amanda have now been on two different, um, interviews talking about similar or like a topics so much of this. And, um, it's been cool to have those conversations with each other that sharpens our own like personal ministries and also how we are able to encourage, uh, each other around us and also people that were having this conversations that are like not women, um, being able to, um, just impart some perspective there. And it's it's I think is encouraging to them to be able to, um, be able to serve in the better in their specific ministries. And so I just think that's a really cool ripple effect. And I think that is like a picture of the Lord, like like how the Lord intended a community to be is that we, you know, sharpen each other by building those relationships and, um, speaking life into each other. So yeah, I just I'm thankful for the opportunity building relationships and speaking life even digitally. So well said. Yes, thanks. Uh, well, I again just want to thank you for this opportunity and you know."

I think having these conversations is so good and needed and like Asia said life-giving. You know, we're not going to see more women stepping up and being celebrated unless these conversations are happening. And so I'm just really glad and thankful to not just be a part but just to see them happening. And so thank you for the opportunity. And you know, I just want to encourage all the ladies out there. You know, if you have been thinking about stepping up into streaming or content creation or ministry online and you've been hesitant, you know, if this is what God is calling you to do it, you know, get it girl, you got it. You know, we need more women stepping up. We do, we really, really do. And so yeah, those are my thoughts.

Oh, very cool. Well, hey, you know what, we're going to wrap up here with Ladies Night. We're gonna bring it to a close. Girl power, or go, whatever else is there with that. But thank you, Asia. Thank you, Amanda, for jumping on the podcast. And we're going to continue on. We're coming to a close here in the next week or so with season four here of Jesus Gamers in Church, the Church Digital podcast. But we gotta, I think we've got a couple episodes left. We gotta check some scheduling things. But you know what, we're excited to learn what we've been learning about gamer culture, nerd culture, and how the church, how we can reach people through this gaming space. And so we once again thank the two ladies for jumping on.

By the way, if you got hate mail, you know what's funny? I've done it. I did a Ladies thing before, women in ministry, and it was interesting though. The women that were actually on the podcast with me got hate as a result of what they said on the podcast. If you got hate, Jeff at the church.digital, and my cell phone number is literally 484-324-8724. You can send whatever hate my way on this. Let's leave the ladies alone. Let them do what God's called them to do. And we're gonna land the plane right there. Thank you very much for jumping on the Church Today podcast. We'll see you next week on the show. You have a good day.